Hounslow Council

Agenda and minutes

Venue: Open Area, Lampton Park Conference Centre (Civic Centre), Lampton Road, Hounslow

Contact: Frances Nwanodi by phone on 020 8583 2064 or by email at  frances.nwanodi@hounslow.gov.uk 

No. Item


Welcome and Apologies for Absence - 19:00 to 19:05


The Chair, Mohammed Chaudhry, welcomed members to the meeting. He thanked Frances Nwanodi’s for her excellent work as Group Secretary for the Group and requested that this be communicated to her manager.


Apologies for absence were noted.



Membership Application - 19:05 - 19:10 pdf icon PDF 449 KB

Additional documents:


The Group had received one membership application from the Old Isleworth Four Roads Residents Association. The Chair informed the applicant that MOPaC were currently reviewing how the police engaged with the community and it was possible that in future consultation groups would have far fewer members.  The Chair asked the applicant whether, considering the uncertain future of the CPCG, he was still willing to proceed with his application.  The applicant confirmed that he was. 


The application was considered. There were no objections and it was accepted.



Minutes of the Meeting held on 19th November 2012 and Matters Arising - 19:10 to 19:15 pdf icon PDF 91 KB


The minutes of the meeting held on 19 November were approved as a true and accurate record of the meeting subject to one amendment – Andrew Hillas, London Probation Service had given his apologies.

Matters arising

Minute 48 – Police Progress Update

The plain borough map had been included in the police progress update report for reference. Three section 60s had been used in the borough due to territorial warfare between gangs during the Olympics which resulted in a youth being stabbed.

The Chair reported that CI Rob Wilson would no longer represent Hounslow Police at the Group as he had moved onto a new role. He thanked CI Wilson for his work and welcomed Inspector Mark Weston and Sergeant Rob Neil who would deliver a presentation to the group.  



MOPaC Consulation on the Police and Crime Plan, deadline for responses 4th March 2013 - 19:15 to 19:25


The Chair invited member’s comments on MOPaC’s Police and Crime Plan consultation. 


Det. Ch. Supt. Carl Bussey reported that a consultation evening would be held on 6 February which would address issues including public access and the future of safer neighbourhood teams.  The meeting would take place from 8-9pm at the Lampton Park Conference Centre. He urged members to attend.


Members expressed regret that the consultation event was only scheduled for one hour. They felt that the community deserved a more open debate with sufficient time to discuss the relevant issues.  Other members agreed, saying that they felt it was a tick box exercise which gave the impression that MOPAC had already made a decision. They said that the community should be made aware of the consultation and how to respond.


Regarding proposals to reduce the number of senior officers Councillor Ellar asked how this would affect the operation of safer neighbourhood teams (SNTs). Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey responded that because the proposed reductions relate to all senior ranks there would be a reduction in the number of all supervising officers in SNTs.


The Chair said that one hour would not be enough time for the event if there was strong public interest.  He said that the strength of the public response may determine how MOPaC engages with the borough on the consultation.


A member commented that it was assumed that the main issue for residents would be the closing of police stations, whereas, for him, it was the overall police model and its impact on the effective policing of the borough. He said there was a risk that the borough would lose the deterrent effect of a police presence on the streets as a result of the proposals. 


Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey explained that MOPaC would be visiting all boroughs during the consultation and the event scheduled for 6 February 2013 would be an initial stage in the consultation. He said there could be further events if it was well attended and he would be prepared to stay beyond the allotted time if this was required.


Regarding the new policing model, members commented that it was important to know the qualitative benefits of the proposals.   Referring to MOPaC’s target to cut 7 priority crimes by 20%, boost public confidence by 20% and reduce spend by 20%, members questioned how the police would increase public confidence if the community perceives that MOPaC are not providing sufficient opportunities for them to question their proposals.


Members said it was important that there was a strong community response.  It was important to generate publicity for the event. The Chair agreed, saying that the challenge was for community leaders to encourage people to take part.



                                               I.      Group Secretary to publish information on the MOPaC consultation to the CPCG website.  



MPS Presentation: Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) - 19:25 to 19:45


Sgt Ron Neil delivered a presentation on automatic number plate recognition (ANPR). He said that the use of ANPR was expanding. The camera captures an image of the number plate and checks it against databases including the DVLA, Insurance Bureau, Police National Computer and local hotlists.

He provided examples of how the ANPR system had led to arrests. Vehicles had activated the system and had been stopped and action taken. He said it had stopped criminals coming back to the area.


He also provided examples of how the police use ANPR and local intelligence to tackle gun crime. The Police could put a vehicle on a local hot list and share this information with neighbouring boroughs. Where a vehicle activates the system the police then stop the vehicle and take action. The police also had cars, vans and mobile kit which picked up activations – all were working well.


Sgt Neil explained that the police have 5 static cameras currently on loan. They were hard for motorists to identify and worked with intercept teams in various parts of the borough. They had achieved positive results during a recent operation tackling uninsured motorists. All the systems could be monitored from Police Computers, mostly in real time, but also allow the police to undertake searches after the event and identify trends.


Sgt. Ron Neil explained that their primary interest was crime – vehicles believed to be used in burglaries, robberies and drug dealing. The secondary interest was to detect traffic offences.  


He explained that they were able to undertake system searches which could identify the movements of a vehicle, for example between the time it was taken and reported stolen. He also gave an example of how it could be used to track a vulnerable missing person.


Det. Ch. Supt. reported that he was keen to invest in this technology. It would help target criminals who move around London and also allow the police to gather intelligence and take a proactive lead on investigations. He said it was well worth the investment.


Questions from members


Responding to members questions regarding the use of stolen number plates Sgt. Ron Neil said that they use ANPR to check with databases whether the nameplate has been stolen and officers would then compare the car using other identifying features. However, criminals often go through Autotrader to clone in-trade number plates. He said that information from the ANPR can be uploaded to the Police National Computer within minutes. There was still room to expand capacity.


Questions from the public


Responding to questions from the public regarding the effectiveness of the ANPR and value for money, Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey explained that the system allowed the police to build a profile and take a dynamic response to crime patterns. He said they would be able to provide specific statistical data which demonstrated its effectiveness.



Police Progress Update - 20:00 to 20:20 pdf icon PDF 89 KB

  • Safer Neighbourhood Team Reports
  • Crime Maps
  • Stop & Search Data
  • Complaints Data

Additional documents:


Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey introduced the police progress report. He said he was trying to put processes and people in place to capitalise on the opportunities ahead. He referred members to the report on page 53 of the agenda pack:


Gun enabled crime - Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey reported that the trend for gun enabled crime was downward pointing. They were starting to see the positive results of police activities in this area.


Residential burglaries - There were 86 less victims in this period and a significant increase in detections compared to previous years.


Homophobic crime - There were a low number of incidents however the trend line was downward pointing. 


Robbery - Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey reported that they were seeing a reduction in the number of incidents.  However, it was important to keep track of trends outside of the borders of the borough.


Referring members to crime maps in the agenda pack he said they looked at trends and seasonal differences, as well as other information, in order to effectively allocate resources and avoid moving them from one area to another on statistical blips. He said he reviewed the evidence 3 times a day.


Responding to members questions Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey said that there were statistics available on disability hate and racial and religious hate crime which would be made available in the next progress report. 


There were no questions on stop and search and complaints data.



Police Community Consultation - Open Questions and Discussion (Group) - 20:20 to 20:30


In response to member’s questions on neighbourhood watch programmes and the staffing of Safer Neighbourhood Teams (SNT’s), Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey said that there would be significant change and investment in SNT’s but that it was important to first change the working profile so that visibility and crime fighting were key. He said that resources had to be made available in the right place at the right time. However, there may be less visibility at times and in places where they are not needed. He said the challenge was to balance pressures and maximise effectiveness with the available resources.  


Although he accepted the need for greater use of resources Councillor Collins said he was concerned that confidentially would be affected if police stations were sited in public spaces such as shopping centres.  Councillor Oulds requested confirmation that there would be an increased number of PC’s in Hounslow as a result of the changes.


Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey confirmed that there would be extra officers in the area.  He said there would be alternative contact points for the police and they would look at where they could be more accessible to the public taking into account confidentiality.


Councillor Ellar said that LBH were facing similar pressures and they could come to an agreement on joint usage of space with the Police.  Det. Ch. Supt. welcomed this. He said the police were looking for new ways of working to explore. There were many options on the table which would be addressed through the consultation.




Police Community Consultation - Open Questions and Discussion (Public) - 20:30 to 20:40

Members of the Group or members of the public may raise matters regarding local policing. A more effective response can be provided if advance notice is given to the Secretary before 1pm on the day of the meeting. A question paper is enclosed with the agenda.


A member of the public asked how police would cut crime and achieve budget cuts, and how this would be perceived by residents. Det. Ch. Supt. Bussey advised that the MOPaC policy plan set the Police a target to cut 7 priority crimes by 20%, boost public confidence by 20% and reduce spend by 20%. He said he was passionate that police officers should be out on the streets fighting crime and they would use their limited resources more efficiently. Although crime was falling they would need to address public perceptions.  


London Wide Update (including minutes where available)

  • No updates at time of print


There were no updates.


MOPaC Newsletters

  • No updates at time of print


There were no newsletters available.


Date and Venue of Next Meeting -7pm on 18th March 2013


The date and time of the next meeting was agreed.


Any Other Business pdf icon PDF 42 KB


The Chair reported that CPCG’s throughout London would be subject to considerable change as a result of new funding arrangements with the Mayors Office for Policing and Crime (MOPaC). The Hounslow CPCG may need to reincarnate and members should consider the Groups options for the future. He proposed that normal rules for the operation of the CPCG be suspended for the next few meetings in order that it could concentrate on its future and form a proposal to be submitted to MOPaC. He proposed to suspend the AGM to allow the Group to concentrate on its future.


The Chair requested that members consider the future of the CPCG and send their proposals to the Groups Secretariat before the end of February.  The issues would then be considered at the next meeting on 18 March 2013. 


Members identified that a proposal would not be agreed until May 2013 and questioned whether it would be presented in time to influence MOPaC. The Chair responded that it was important for the Group to have their house in order and take an agreed proposal to them.  He added that MOPaCs approach was not prescriptive therefore it was an opportunity for the Group to look at different ways of working.


Councillor Collins commented that CPCGs would not cease completely and MOPaC would consult with stakeholders. There could be some time before the Group would be required to reincarnate. Members suggested that the Group continue with its current programme and the AGM.  As the situation was unclear members said the Group should not risk making changes for a situation which may not materialise and should therefore continue with normal duties and manage the change.


The Chair invited members to submit their comments and proposals to the Group Secretariat by the end of February 2013.



                                   I.      Members to submit comments and proposals on the future of the Hounslow CPCG to the Group Secretariat by 28 February 2013.